Heavier limbs can mask release issues. That is one of many reasons it is good to practice with lighter limbs. It really shows up when you drop down in the 20 lb range. 35 to 40 lbs is where a lot of good shooters do a lot of shooting, and should get off the fingers cleanly if you are doing your part.

 

I never snap shot but I think it's release form. For me, I think the heavy limbs pulled out with more force and made it harder for me pluck or mess up.
If you're rushing your shot b/c or can't hold you have issues - over bowed, target panic, etc.
But I think this shows the wisdom of using lighter limbs for form practice. You should be able to release cleanly or hold as long as you need at any weight you plan to shoot.

 

I was going to say exactly what CMShooter states. Lots of people come to me with a problem. They bring their hunting bow. After the show me the problem I bring out a 20-25 pound bow. They find out that they're not reaching alignment with their hunting bow. Some can't - overbowed.

Most snap shooters don't reach alignment and they are going to get TP. Maybe not tomorrow, but 5, 10 years down the road they'll have it. One of the best shots I've ever seen was a snap shooter that reached alignment. Took him 30 years to get TP. Now, he can't get near full draw and hitting something at 20 is out of the question.

Bowmania

 

Most snap shooters don't reach alignment and they are going to get TP. Maybe not tomorrow, but 5, 10 years down the road they'll have it. One of the best shots I've ever seen was a snap shooter that reached alignment. Took him 30 years to get TP. Now, he can't get near full draw and hitting something at 20 is out of the question.

TRUE👍

 

"I do not advocate squeezing shoulders and declaring 'bone on bone'"

9 of 10 without pulling through with the Rhomboids the shot will collapse.
Bone on bone is just a description of a Bow arm pushing and relaxed. A tense bow arm usually turns into too much grip and torquing.

 

You are describing exactly the robotic rhetoric that is clumsy and mechanical in many hunting situations. With continuous pulling through to anchor there is no collapse. If your static target style is what you need to do, fine. But your way is not the only way, even though certain similarities exists. This early release, although it happens, is not a guaranteed outcome and that is not part of the shooting style and one must work to avoid. You fly with your species and I will fly with mine.
When you jump a pheasant, are you going lockup bone on bone with a shotgun?

 

Now I remember you!

 

If you don't have time to shoot with proper form you don't actually have a shot opportunity, you're just flinging arrows and hoping to make a hit that will eventually recover your game.
The animals deserve better.

 

This preaching has been a common sermon from target based shooters as long as i can remember. Do I trust myself enough to shoot at a bounding deer? Never. Do i trust myself to shoot at a walking calm deer at closer ranges, all day. Do I think that i am going to shoot at a flying pheasant or running rabbit? Every time.

 

I think we've all been down this road. It took me 50 years of shooting to come to terms with my limitations. When I did that I became a better archer. My own experience I was shooting to heavy of a bow. I dropped 10lbs pounds and reinvented my shooting style. I started watching target archers and applied their techniques to my hunting archery. I make every arrow count and focus on each aspect of the shot. The hold, focus and pulling through the shot. When I do not adhere to my own rules my shot suffers. I keep my shots close while hunting and practice at longer distances. I practice with the bows I hunt with.

 

Hmmm ...draw/focus on spot...anchor....1-2...loose ... Go pull arrow from bulls-eye,sometimes lol

 

Hmmm ...draw/aim...anchor....1-2-3....loose

No, it's see the objective and decide to do a shot, draw, anchor and seat in, pulling with the back muscles and aiming refined release follow through.

 

I suffered from target panic. I still have it to a small degree. My own experience. It was at its worse when I was shooting a lot of arrows with poor results. My groups were terrible. My hold at full draw was nonexistent. I had to retrain myself and understand the hold and control of release was everything. I no longer have long shooting sessions. I focus on the quality of a few good shots from 10 to 30 yards.

 

One day with my Widow Maker original Sabor climbing tree stand i went up a basswood tree, all the way to the cluster of branches, about 25 feet. Back in those days I was a construction foreman and I built some very large multistory concrete and steel buildings. Height meant nothing to me. Anywho, while i was way up there, a 6 pointer came by. Almost straight down. I had to reverse cant my my 89 pound 70" Kramer Big 5 and shoot right past my foot. Guess what, I missed. Then later a group of turkeys came by, about 10 feet from the base of my tree, this time i did not reverse cant, but i put faith in my harness strap, by the waif I would have fallen out the harness strap would have killed me for certain, I leaned out canted the bow properly and guess what, I missed again. I gave my WidowMaker away to another fool monkey. Ground is good.

 

I used to think snap shooting was working for me. However, I would have streaks of inconsistency. Now that I’m shooting lighter bows and working on one piece at a time (Bow hand then bow arm then draw then anchor then release) I’m finding that being able to hold and anchor for a second or two is much more consistent for me. I know some great shooters that snap shoot but its not for me.

 

I am far from an expert but I have experienced that same thing with heavier limbs. As soon as I get to anchor the string is gone.i am not snap shooting but with the heavier weight I don’t have time to loiter at full draw. Pausing too long creates form issues for me anyway.

 

Heavier limbs can really mess you up at first..

 

If someone wants to snap shoot, which is not a bad word, he will probably have fewer release errors with a modest increase in weight. People who want to snap shoot can probably handle a modest increase in weight better than those who hold at full draw. More than a modest increase in weight will probably create more problems for most people than are solved by having an easier release. Of course, there are a few people, like Howard Hill, who thrived snap shooting very heavy bows.

I think that managing the release was one of the easier problems I had to figure out along the way. I would say that in an average class of 16 people learning to shoot with 15-25# bows, one or two might have problems with their releases. A more common problem would be creeping, which results in a bad release, but is something that happens before the release happens.

 

Good explanations above. Heavier weight will pull the string out of your fingers, but like cm said heavier can mask release issues.
Lighter limbs you need to have better release and follow through or it will show, exposing the flaws.
Lots of people shoot lower weight to work on form and release.
Chad

 

Learning a solid form correct shot sequence and aiming a deliberately aimed arrow is possible.
Target Panic is something that many of us eventually deal with and may try to creep back in from time to time but properly dealt with can be pushed out of the shot.
It's mental and can be de-programmed with some discipline. Jim.Casto had or has an excellent approach and method to gain confidence and consistency.

 

Draw, hold it, release. i can skip the hold it part it with 25 and under shots with ASL bows 50 and over, but it takes practice to maintain full form control. I must stop and hold it with any bow under 40 pounds and especially short bows and recurves, also I find with lighter bows that i have a better release with a Kantpinch tab versus a stout shooting glove.

 

My over 20 yard left hand shooting cycle, if I put words to it, would be draw, (rising spread draw last 6" flat) tighter release. My right hand shooting cycle at longer shots is draaaw, pull through, follow through, if I put words to it. Oddly enough i often find that i hold longer on flying birds than 20 and under, which is smooth draw, anchor, release in almost a non-stop motion. I hunt open country, although try to set up for the 20 and under, it does not always work out. I have let many more spooky deer pass by at 15 and under than the deer that i killed at 30 yards that were totally unaware of my presence. I think shot timing and the decision of go or no-go is the hardest thing to learn.

 

As I understand it, a snap shooter touching his anchor is the same as some other shooter clicking the clicker, touching the feather to nose, or the subconscious sending a release signal to his brain. At that moment, the arrow is gone. At any point prior to touching anchor, the snap shooter should be able to change his mind and let down; for example, if a deer suddenly turned to face him so he no longer had a clear shot to the vitals. If a snap shooter had committed to the shot, but hadn't yet touched anchor, and couldn't let down because he was too far along to stop, that would be a sign of target panic.

On a slightly different subject, not all snap shooters are instinctive shooters, and vice versa. Howard Hill stated that he was not an instinctive shooter, because he consciously placed his arrow point where he thought it ought to be, albeit without calculating a gap. And yet it is clear from watching his videos that he was a snap shooter.

Rick Welch is an instinctive shooter, because he does not consciously place his arrow point anywhere (how far away is it? Don't know, don't care), although he does notice where it is, and no doubt that information is used by his subconscious to trigger his shot. And yet it is clear from watching him shoot and taking lessons from him that he considers it vitally important to have a 2 second hold, so he is definitely not a snap shooter.

 

I shot through the Mayflower course right behind Welch years ago before he lost weight. He teaches to hold and does hold at anchor and aims. I'm guessing he shoots "Gapstinctive" which many would say gaps are automatic from shooting at different yardages for years.

 

Looks like the answer is yes, because you using more 💪. However, if your in correct form. It may not be that much of a difference.

DDD

 

Remember those Baker tree stands? when i lived south of Eu Claire, i just had to have one, alll those tree, How do I get up there? . I used a rope cinch as a hand clamp and no safety strap. One day, outside of Oseo, high up on a pope tree, a group of deer were behind me, I turned around on the Baker Bitch. I stepped to close to the trunk of the tree. I went 18 feet to 8 feet in one second. The stand caught, I did a perfect one and a Half gainer with a twist and landed on my feet. It did not look like i was hurt, but that frozen ground flattened both my arches and ended my season.

 

I draw slow and hold a bit.
How I practice.
The process stays the same but can be sped up once ingrained.
Still not snap shooting.

For me, after some health stuff........getting muscle memory and strength has been a problem.
My bow arm shoulder just isn't coming along like I want.

 

Best thing I ever did was get some 26# limbs for one of my ILF risers. It lets me really concentrate on each piece of the shot without much fatigue.

 

Back when my light bow was 64 pounds and my heavy hunting bow was 96, Found that I could not get a clean release with my target bows, I could force things into the release that made problems. With heavy bows my pull through was automatic and the release was always clean. I could settle myself down and go into a multistep ritual, much like the 12 step programs used today. But if I used such a mechanical method hunting a variety game, I would miss more than hit and miss many opportunities. In hunting my shot needs to have one thought, hit the spot.

 

Maybe they have the same problem I have. Not getting the front shoulder down and scapula back. If a push and pull with both arms? My front shoulder is out and not bone to bone. Virtually impossible to use your back on the front side. With compound low hold weight isn't as big of a problem as trad. With stabilization you can activate the shot with just a push.
Now with hold weight and finger release. John Demmer posted that he uses a deep hook to get a clean release. I suspect your hook has more to do with being cleaner than the hold weight as well as your tab.
But as I said above setup and holding with back tension should be more important to getting your arms the relax in order for a clean release.
DDD

 

Fore I visualize the front end as forward and in rather than just forward. The tendency of letting it settle back seems to promote the shoulders not being in alignment.
For me anyway.