Limb Stability Comparison
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If you would like me to post up your other video which is of me I'll help ya out 
If you want to discredit a company you really should get more technically adept
Maybe Mat can help you
Yes we all know super recurve limbs have more tip movement after the shot
Thank you for being the endless researcher
If you want to discredit a company you really should get more technically adept
Maybe Mat can help you
Yes we all know super recurve limbs have more tip movement after the shot
Thank you for being the endless researcher
Please do.
And I'm not trying to discredit anyone. Come on, that's beneath you. All I wanted to do was have real discussion about the difference in movement in the limbs. It really interests me, especially with all the talk about stability lately.
Your bow is OBVIOUSLY quiet. You OBVIOUSLY shoot it well. The performance is OBVIOUSLY good. So that leaves us with the question...
How important is it? What does it mean to have it or not have it? I'd love to know what it actually means to a real shooter. That's all I was trying to do.
Neither of the bows in the videos are mine, so I don't have any ax to grind. Some people really like to dig into the nuts and bolts of it. The problem is, whenever anyone asks a question, they are automatically accused of trying to discredit someone.
I was actually hoping Sid could weigh in on it.
Well, I tried but I guess I'm just too dumb to figure it out.
http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpju2AXOv3HxCfY07mkOaEg
Here is a link to both the videos. I tried to isolate them and convert them to the same speed.
The releases of the two shooters seem to be about the same, not terrible but not rock solid either.
Anyone who is interested in watching them and having a legitimate discussion, I'm all for it.
It doesn't take much, but if someone is smarter than me and wants to post both videos side by side in the same post, have at it.
http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpju2AXOv3HxCfY07mkOaEg
Here is a link to both the videos. I tried to isolate them and convert them to the same speed.
The releases of the two shooters seem to be about the same, not terrible but not rock solid either.
Anyone who is interested in watching them and having a legitimate discussion, I'm all for it.
It doesn't take much, but if someone is smarter than me and wants to post both videos side by side in the same post, have at it.
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Sylvan,
I think this would be an interesting discussion. I have a set of Border Hex6Ws and some Uukha UX 100s and have been recently talking to an olympic recurve shooter (and by olympic, I mean they have been in the Olympics). There is a good question about the extra vibrations on gets from the super recurves. He thought the Borders were very good limbs; his biggest concern was the long term effect on the arm muscles (similar to tennis elbow, the way it was explained to me) from the vibrations, given 1) the amount of time he spent shooting (~ 8 hours/day) and the distance (60m).
It was suggested adding vibration dampeners would be good, and even with my stiff riser (Best Zenit) I have noticed a difference with them.
I get the feeling that some amount of use of Hoyt, W&W etc comes from you shoot whoever is supplying you, but that some difference does exist and that is why Hoyt has developed their Quattros which apparently is getting huge demand in Korea.
He also pointed out that the risers Olympians use are much more flexible than the bare bow risers that many of us shooting super recurve limbs use, which would make a big difference on the feel and muscle impact.
In the end, here is all that I DO know. There are people all over the world that are extremely good archers and they shoot different equipment. So: 1) all of these systems work. Beyond that, I would love to hear more!
Alan
I think this would be an interesting discussion. I have a set of Border Hex6Ws and some Uukha UX 100s and have been recently talking to an olympic recurve shooter (and by olympic, I mean they have been in the Olympics). There is a good question about the extra vibrations on gets from the super recurves. He thought the Borders were very good limbs; his biggest concern was the long term effect on the arm muscles (similar to tennis elbow, the way it was explained to me) from the vibrations, given 1) the amount of time he spent shooting (~ 8 hours/day) and the distance (60m).
It was suggested adding vibration dampeners would be good, and even with my stiff riser (Best Zenit) I have noticed a difference with them.
I get the feeling that some amount of use of Hoyt, W&W etc comes from you shoot whoever is supplying you, but that some difference does exist and that is why Hoyt has developed their Quattros which apparently is getting huge demand in Korea.
He also pointed out that the risers Olympians use are much more flexible than the bare bow risers that many of us shooting super recurve limbs use, which would make a big difference on the feel and muscle impact.
In the end, here is all that I DO know. There are people all over the world that are extremely good archers and they shoot different equipment. So: 1) all of these systems work. Beyond that, I would love to hear more!
Alan
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I cant get this post out my head...
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Alan, please forgive my ignorance, I am not worthy of "big shoot" consideration, I do not have 23-25" risers, etc.
In my ignorance, I wonder when you refer to his concerns = long term effect on muscles from vibrations from shooting 8 hours per day and 60m.........
IS HE saying that the 60M is a factor, as opposed to 20-30M 8 hrs/day?
I need to stay on point.....but details matter......thanks in advance.....
In my ignorance, I wonder when you refer to his concerns = long term effect on muscles from vibrations from shooting 8 hours per day and 60m.........
IS HE saying that the 60M is a factor, as opposed to 20-30M 8 hrs/day?
I need to stay on point.....but details matter......thanks in advance.....
Thank you for bringing that back up Sid. You can see I've been asking the same question for months, and nobody seems to want to touch it with a ten foot pole.
Is it "springy?" Is it "noodly?" Is it "stable?" Is it a "performance enhancement?" What the heck it "it?"
Now that there are to videos to compare, it's obvious that one has "it" and one doesn't have "it."
If "it" is a positive thing in one limb, is "it" a positive thing in another limb?
If "it" is a negative thing in one limb, is "it" a negative thing in another limb?
Does "it" really mean anything to the archer?
The only time I ever seem to see "it" talked about is when someone is using "it" or lack of "it" as a selling point.
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in my opinion left and right is a problem.
fore and aft is a problem with a caviat.
if both are travelling back and forth in sync. the NP will stay static.
if they rock back and forth out of sync, then the NP will wobble up and down...
the latter here can be controlled with grip pressure, pushing high in the grip or low in the grip.
this will upset the limb timing.
some archers can shot with NO limbflap, while others on the same bow will get limb flap.
i do think its funny, that all this comotion over a video of a guy shooting a bow hes had for 3 days. a bow that is renound for a different grip position within the riser. so needs a different style. if you shoot a DAS style riser where the riser likes to more pushed up into the throat, then flip straight away to one of our risers then you will get limb flap with the same limbs and the same tiller.
figure out the grip by spending some time with it, and things change a little.
but hey, the internet is here for free speach.
fore and aft is a problem with a caviat.
if both are travelling back and forth in sync. the NP will stay static.
if they rock back and forth out of sync, then the NP will wobble up and down...
the latter here can be controlled with grip pressure, pushing high in the grip or low in the grip.
this will upset the limb timing.
some archers can shot with NO limbflap, while others on the same bow will get limb flap.
i do think its funny, that all this comotion over a video of a guy shooting a bow hes had for 3 days. a bow that is renound for a different grip position within the riser. so needs a different style. if you shoot a DAS style riser where the riser likes to more pushed up into the throat, then flip straight away to one of our risers then you will get limb flap with the same limbs and the same tiller.
figure out the grip by spending some time with it, and things change a little.
but hey, the internet is here for free speach.
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whats the difference in 3 under and split finger. Alot of folks will say very little if you change your NP to suit.
Now i think people need to give credit to the fact that Joe was shooting My Dads bow, With My dads string. so my dads hand geom. giving my dads pressure. and limb timing!.
go figure...
so if split vs 3 under = a differnece in bow reaction, somehow i think grip location will be the same.
If i read "Haters will hate, lovers will love" one more time i think i will laugh out loud!
Now i think people need to give credit to the fact that Joe was shooting My Dads bow, With My dads string. so my dads hand geom. giving my dads pressure. and limb timing!.
go figure...
so if split vs 3 under = a differnece in bow reaction, somehow i think grip location will be the same.
If i read "Haters will hate, lovers will love" one more time i think i will laugh out loud!
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Sid, he does not now. He wouldn't say it, but it seemed that between the lines that is part of the issues with those guys - let's face it, archery is not the sport you go into to get the multi-million dollar contracts, so any sponsoring you get is very important.
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Steve, that is a great question and simply is further proof that I am a neophyte (details=consistency). I did not ask that specifically, so when I see him again I will. My UNDERSTANDING, and I emphasize this is my interpretation at this point, is that it is a combination of the two. Given that their risers are more flexible, and they are shooting typically ~50# because of the distance, that they get concerned about the physical impact.
I will ask him more details when I see him, hopefully next week.
Alan
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Does this mean that: 1) Haters love haters and lovers hate lovers or that or the other way around?!
:deadhorseI really don't consider it "all this commotion" over one video. It's just that it's the first time many of us have seen that particular style limb in slow motion. If you look at the other video that was posted by Tori...
the same thing is happening with the Hex 6 HBB2 limbs. This would lead one to believe that it might not be the shooter, riser, or grip position.
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