Ethics and (professional) archery

[Flint Hills Tex]

Well, watching the winter Olympics has got me thinking...I would much rather watch honest competition and admire true skill. It seems that there are hardly any professional athletes who don't dope, no matter what discipline. I wish I could believe archery were some last bastion of honest sportsmanship, but I fear that dishonesty is rampant from top to bottom!

Let's start with doping: I used to be so sure that there was no such thing among archers. I mean, what advantage could steroids or anabolics possibly bring to an archer? Then I found out that there have been cases of archers using ß-blockers to slow down their heartbeat. They even get team doctors to verify bogus diagnosis's of high blood pressure or tachycardia in order to justify the prescription. Can't disqualify somebody on prescription meds, can we?

Now let's take a look at 3D or field tournaments, where scoring can become very fanciful with no judges (or other inconvenient witnesses) near by. Or how about some folks scores in on-line leagues?

I don't get it! I'm as competitive as anybody out there, but I don't want to win at any price, and certainly not by cheating! Because that's what doping or manipulating scores is: CHEATING!

[owlmagnet]

Flint, the closest I've ever been to "doping" in archery was when I was the only American member of the Sindlefingen Feldsbogen Schutzen and I got sucked into a "schnaaps round" halfway through a 3-D Tournament. After the "refreshment", the German's all shot better--while my targets developed an astonishing ability to remain unscathed! Never made that mistake again... Bob Wilson

[Flint Hills Tex]

Flint, the closest I've ever been to "doping" in archery was when I was the only American member of the Sindlefingen Feldsbogen Schutzen and I got sucked into a "schnaaps round" halfway through a 3-D Tournament. After the "refreshment", the German's all shot better--while my targets developed an astonishing ability to remain unscathed! Never made that mistake again... Bob Wilson

Yeah, well, it's hard to hit a "moving" target. Those Germans are used to that Schnaps, which, for all of you folks who've never been to Germany, is actually the hard stuff. If you ain't used to it, it'll really go to your head fast!

[SandSquid]

There is doping in archery, just not so much the "physical" drugs, Hell, I have to take 2 flexoril just to shoot 60 arrows.... but archers may look towards things to help with concentration and focus things that boots dopamine and norepinephrine etc. Ritalin, Stratera, Adderall, Vyvanse, Dextrostat, and Dexedrine.)

[pondscum2]

boy, SandSquid. don't know about the others you mentioned, but i wouldn't take a Ritalin if i needed to concentrate on anything. accidentally took one of my son's meds (ADHD diagnosed-NOT!) & i didn't quit babbling for 3 hours. amusing yes, useful ? not so much for me, anyway...:) scummer

[Warped Arrow]

Is drinking a couple pots of coffee before a shoot considered doping? If it is I am guilty....hey, maybe thats why I have a bit of trouble holding steady on the spot!!!

[Flint Hills Tex]

Is drinking a couple pots of coffee before a shoot considered doping? If it is I am guilty....hey, maybe thats why I have a bit of trouble holding steady on the spot!!!

That's the kind of doping your competition likes!:)

Over here in Bavaria, Germany, beer is considered a food, not an alcoholic beverage (really, it's even a part of the state laws on food and health). Obviously, too much of a good thing is bad, but you would be hard pressed to find a club that does not sell beer during breaks at their tournaments. Most of the archers in my club shoot just fine after a break for a beer, though I find that it does affect my performance negatively. So I usually save the beer for after the shoot.

But seriously, have any of you heard of cases of doping in archery?

[DanaC]

I used to shoot a lot of pool, and a beer or two would often get me on my game. Unfortunately the next several would knock me back off ;-)

Don't think alcohol and weapons is a good idea. jmo

I don't know if 'pro' archers or high level amateurs are doing any of this stuff, sounds stupid enough to be real, but that's the cynic in me speaking ;-)/2

[Flint Hills Tex]

Well, guys, I've been busy these past 8 months (went back to school to work on a master's degree, but still working to pay the bills), so I haven't had much time to write.

My son, Paul, has shot a number of times at official ranking tournaments against a kid from another club, let's call him John. Paul told me that John was working hard to psych him out during one of the tournaments. Paul asked him why he was doing that, and John replied that his father had taught him that as a tactic to weaken your opponent.

I talked to Paul and told him that I hoped he would never act that way towards another archer, that that kind of behavior is NOT displaying good sportsmanship. He agreed wholeheartedly with me.

I am sure that most archers are honest and upright as well as good sports, but I guess that there are folks who want to win so badly, that they will do anything, no matter how unfair or unethical it may be.

Anyway, here's to all the true sportsmen out there! :cheers:

[DanaC]

Flint, 'psyching out' your opponent is a reality in most sports. Even competition poker on ESPN ;-)/2

If there was big 'pro' money on the line, you bet I'd get in your head and dance, but archery? At the level 99.9999% of us shoot?

Don't get me wrong, a bit of friendly ribbing among buddies doesn't bother me, but a great shot is a great shot, and the day I don't compliment a buddy for nailing it, I'll burn my bows and use my arrows for tomato stakes. (And I -hate- gardening!)

[Matt_Potter]

Here is one for you. Our State shoot here in Montana is a 2 day shoot - after the 1st day I asked one of the top Open class Compound shooters to go back and walk the course with me an talk me through a couple of the shots (you shoot a different course the second day)

Say what you will about the gadget guys but, they really know shot set up and reading the terrain.

Anyhow one of the shots was 1/2 way up a good hill. I wheezed my way up there but, the compound guy just dragged but behind me. I finally asked what was up and was told "I am taking Beta Blockers and if I go to fast I'll black out" - to which I responded - "heck I didn't know you had heart problems" The answer I got back is "I don't I am taking them to steady my nerves."

Beta blockers for the Montana State shoot give me a frigging break

Matt

[Sid]

here at our club, they will try and put you off, in the most obvious ways. but with a sence of humour... it kinda adds to the day!

for example, telling you your shoe lace us undone while at full draw, or two of them facing you asking questions about your forum...

there are no prizes, just banter and competition...

i suppose its kinda depends on the intent.

It also tournament hardens you, you will see others shooting well, and might loose track that your also doing well... there is also the times where your shooting soo well, till you ask your score, then you try too hard to keep it up and put even yourself off... I think this comes down to mental toughness, which we all need at different stages of our life and a good skill to switch on and switch off.

[steve morley]

I know an English archer that smokes Marajuana and informed the IFAA, they did nothing. The IFAA have an anti doping policy but have NEVER enforced it.

with Fita if you get to the final of any international tourney you can be pretty sure you will be tested.

At a tourney if anybody plays mind games with me it doesn't upset me, I just take it as a sign of fear, if anything it makes me shoot with MORE confidence.:)

[Redbow]

Steve, Marajuana ,,,,,,,, really lol.
Never ever become an informant on the behavior of fellow shooters, I mean what was this guy going to do? Get hungry on the course, shoot slow and then fall asleep?????
Your job is to shoot, period.
The Ifaa have better things to worry about!

I have found at the important shoots, if one is lucky enough to make it into a top group, there is very little talking between competitors.

I know back in 04 at the IFAA world field, the only thing I said on the last day was here comes the rain, Steve Morley just went about the business of fine shooting, and larry Yien did his best to keep his title!

Now when I shooting practice rounds with the guys at the local range,the ribbing and banter is relentless, and that is seen as part of the game.
And in reality if ones form is ingrained and the metal focus is solid there is not much that one can do to throw a really solid shooter!

[Flint Hills Tex]

Oh, I've nothing against bantering at the practice range. We do plenty of that in our club, and it's all part of the fun. I wouldn't want to miss it! For example if I'm the last guy walking back from the target after getting my arrows, I'm bound to hear some comment like, "Texans may be fast on the draw, but that's about all that's fast about 'em." Or another shooter may stand next to you and ask if he can shoot the same target as me, and I'll say, "Sure, there's plenty of room," and he answers, "Well, I see you saved the gold for me to use."

But I do feel that, at an official tournament in a sport such as ours, you should be able to expect a certain level of sportsmanship, fairness and respect among competitors. At least that's the way I'm trying to teach my boys to behave.

Steve, that's an interesting strategy you've developed. I never thought of it that way, that my opponent may be scared of me.

[Larry Hatfield]

when vic wunderlee was a teenager and competing all over the world he was treated very badly by a lot of "adults". he answered usually by outshooting them. thats the very best comeback.
i had the fun of keeping vic in bows until he got to college and was impressed with him at a very young age.

[DanaC]

Well, after yesterday, I have to admit that banter can be hazardous to your health. Dave and Paul had me near top rolling in the poison ivy. Way too many 'shaft' jokes, and we won't even get into the 'line lickers'...