Is Mandatory Hunting Safety Hurting Us

[CarolinaBob]

Recently I and probably you have become aware of the dwindling numbers of hunters, especially teens, Is mandatory hunter safety course part of the blame? Are teens wanting to hunt not willing to give the time to travel and attend a manadatory safety course? Many non-hunters still feel it is UNSAFE to go into the woods during hunting season, I know bowhunter who feel it is unsafe to go into the woods during gun season, So do this mandatory course accomplish anything?

[Viper]

Bob -

I can't speak for people in coimmunities where kids grow up with hunting, learning from their parents, grandparents, etc, but around here, seening people at our local hunter and bowhunter (saftey) ed classes, it's pretty obvious, this is the ONLY training they get. I put the hunter safety courses on the same level as a driving test. Neither is a sure bet of anything, but still better than nothing for most people I see on a regular basis.

If a few hours on a couple of days is tuning them off, maybe they shouldn't be out in the woods in the fiirst place. :2cents:

Viper out.

[waterone]

CB, in the in the rural south, probably like most places across the US, kids, teens and even adults are not continuing to hunt or not taking up hunting for many reasons. I really don't think one of them is the hunters safety courses, themselves. Someof the instructors can be hard to take (at least some that I've seen/heard) but there is far more "stuff" out there vying for the time of most people.

I too am loath to go out in the woods during gun season, at least in some locations - too many gun hunters are indescriminate in their targets. Some seem to think that a hunting trip is more like a tailgate party for a football game. Even a substanial portion of bowhunters seem to have the attitude that consuption of beer and stronger stuff is an absolute requirement for a hunting trip. To me the use of a weapon designed to kill is not a casual activity.

A real turn off to many who approach life and death with more than a little spiritual aspect is the "smackdown" mentality of some hunters, today. I would think that has a significant negative impact.

Really, as far as the youth, the pull of modern urban life and atttudes is far more of a challenge than the negative aspects of a hunter safety course.

[Bowjack]

I have a few friends that are also my hunting buddies. They are rabid hunters, yet their children are reluctant to hunt with us or anyone else, and they have often said that they don't really like hunting. Apparently, they are more entertained with their gadgets, video games, dvd's, I-pods etc. and demonstrate an over-indulgence in this stuff rather than hunting.

However, when we were growing up, you couldn't keep us out of the woods. There wasn't as much to do back then anyway, we had none of these contraptions anyway. The point is, you would think being mentored by their fathers, having a head start they would love to venture in to the woods and hunt. I think times are different, at least around here. We rode our bicycles everywhere and went camping, hunting, and fishing every chance we could. The culture and times are changing.

I really don't think it has anything to do with the hunter safety course. In fact, the bowhunting course for that matter was even more challenging back then as you had to qualify (shoot) to receive a certificate.

This is just my viewpoint.

[Sam Dunham]

The same question could be ask about seatbelts and motorcycle helmats. The state protecting us against our will. More laws are seldom a good thing. Just a much more complcated world. Our culture is dwindling from the Rabbit and squirrel hunts to laptops and video games.

[tuffshot]

I like Vipers analogy of being simular to a drivers test, except for one point and that would be for most there is no hands on training. With most of us already being hunters there are so many things thru experiance that we take for granted that others would not know.

As far as the youth gaining interest in hunting, it is becoming more geographic all the time. The mind set of our youth and video games are being blamed. Part of the mind set is self preservation for kids today. Temptations of drugs, gangs and other distractions keeps more kids from getting outside more than ever. For some it a different survival game in life. It is becoming a technical world for many reasons. With our kids hiding in another world does not allow kids to explore the unknow with out it being virtual.

Honda has a commercial that really touches on a key factor. Two kids are playing a video game (dirt bike racing) the Icon of the game stops and says "Why are you sitting there and playing this game when you could be out riding a Honda and one day some kid may be playing a game featuring you?" This is true in hunting as well.

Hunting videos are the virtual reality of many a want to be hunter. They watch them but do not get out and experiance hunting for themselves. Then a brief training class comes along and opens the window with only a breif view of what hunting entails.

Is a hunters safety course hurting hunting? Not really but it is a far cry from being a perfect solution for the problem.

[CarolinaBob]

Tuffshot I agree with your answer but what you have described IMHO sounds like a parenting problem. Parents seem to not have time for their chidren. My original idea on this thread was: is mandatory hunters safety course worth the time, do they teach anything, or just government wanting to control us. If hunters safety is so great then why do we have to wear orange during gun season? Don' they teach target identification?

[Bowjack]

Having worked in a major sporting goods store, I truly feel that the hunter safety and bow safety courses are woefully insufficient. How many people would venture onto state land during the opening weekend of gun season with or without blaze orange. In addition, from my experience of selling hunting equipment, far too many people with hunting licenses would ask me where to aim on a deer when shooting. Sometimes you have raise the bar to improve the standard, though do agree that a nanny government does tend to impinge upon my freedom. However, rules are precipitated by accidents and incidents caused by human error.

[tuffshot]

CarolinaBob,

The hunter safety course is a beginning of an educational journey. It seems to be on about a 5th grade level. I feel there are some who try and start their kids out too young without understanding the whole concept. Even some of the adults have trouble with that level. Jeff Foxworthy even has a show indicating that effect.:)

Ohio's class is held in a 2 day session / 4 hours each day. A lot of material is covered. For the young beginner it can be overwhelming and for the adult beginner it can be hit and miss as to what they take away from the class.
Some type of education is needed, even if they have to give away a small handbook for future refferance after the class is over. We used to have a safety handbook at work if there was a question on a safety rule it could be looked up either by the employee or supervisor. Now they want to put everything on a computer training class that most either sleep thru or are numb to that kind of training. Safety rules are broken daily even after the computer training.

The thing is hunting is not what it used to be. Mentors for most newcomers no longer exsist. Some parents do not hunt so it is hard to blame them for what a youth is trying to understand, thheir involvment is needed but they may not have enuff interest to help.

EX: My neighbor bought his son a new 12 guage shot gun for deer season (he does not hunt) For his size and age I suggested a 20 guage, but the 12 guage was on sale. I took the boy out with me and my son the sight the weapons in for the upcoming season. His son shot the 12 guage 1 time, it was more than he wanted and would not shoot again but was still planning on going hunting. I just knew it would not be with me.

[CarolinaBob]

"Sometimes you have raise the bar to improve the standard, though do agree that a nanny government does tend to impinge upon my freedom. However, rules are precipitated by accidents and incidents caused by human error."

So all motor vehicles should be orange and have flashing lights, no entertainment systems in the vehilce, radio, etc, oh and of course no cell phone useage.

[Bowjack]

Okay, so let people into the woods with firearms and bows without any training? That is irresponsible to the quarry and other hunters especially as society changes direction, a good many mentors are aging, and more foreign born hunters enter the equation. Not to mention that hunting ethics are also taught in these courses. Hunting is our heritage and legacy, therefore it must be protected and people must be taught safety and ethics at some point.

[stantond]

I was recently waiting at a garage on Saturday morning and there was a TV talk show playing. The topic of West Virginia introducing hunter/hunting safety into their schools was presented. Everyone waiting at the garage (and it was only about 8-10 people) visibly expressed their dislike of the idea. Maybe because it was West Virginia? Maybe because it involved firearm safety? Maybe because it was about hunting and something they could never see themselves doing?

It was interesting. While I would not call these people stupid, they were ignorant and happy to remain that way - or whatever way the TV media directed them. Sheep, lemmings, whatever you want to call the attribute, it is very common.

Play golf. Don't go shoot arrows. That's not a social activity. That's not civilized.

Hunting? You have to go thorough a hunter safety course? Why? Who hunts anymore? Learn to play golf.

I think you are right in that the number of hunters is not increasing. For wildlife management that isn't good. From a recent hunting safety course I attended, most people (i.e. the sheep) are oblivious of hunters and have no real objection. Groups like PETA try to stop hunting activities and create news. While they lose, any news is bad news for hunters.

Hunting ethics, IMO, is the most important information to come out of any hunter safety course. Also the terminology, such as 'harvesting' an animal is more politically correct. No dead doe strapped to the hood as you pull into the 7-eleven for a coffee, no "I love gut piles" tee shirts, no night scope equipped crossbows for the public to see, that is all bad. Any ethical hunter knows these things, but brain damaged people (and I include youth in that category) sometimes struggle to do what is right.

People who are ethical are also responsible. They won't shoot you in the woods. It's not the one time per life Hunter Safety course that's the problem.


Stan

[Seagull]

As a non-hunter considering hunting, the problem is not hunter education courses but rather the difficulties assosiated with hunting:

Sure, I could use a charge card and get the latest suff I don't need.

Then I need to learn about maintaining my equipment.

Then I have to find a place to hunt.

Then I have to understand the animal I am hunting

Then I have to worry about getting shot or acccidently shooting someone else.

Then I have to understand how to clean and process the game I might get.

Then I have to .....

This is all too much for most people to address. A video game takes a lot less effort.

But, for other that is part of the challenge of hunting. That combined with being able to outdoors, is near heaven.

For me, I am working on my archery skill and camping with my boys while I find out about the other stuff.

Of course, I could take a different route....

[SteveGabriel]

I'm a non-hunter who was a hunter wannabe when I was a teenager in the '70's. The problem is I grew up in New York City. I could get the gear I wanted by going to the Herman's sporting goods in Times Square. I bought a Shakespeare Tioga and some Bear cedar arrows. I even got a couple of Bear Razorheads. I was 16 at the time.
Problem was, where do you hunt when you live in a big city? Heck, I had to travel for over an hour on the subway and then the bus just to get to the Pelham Bay archery range!

I think with the bulk of people in the country living in or around large urban areas with limited hunting access, just learning the rudiments like how to get back to your car after you went into the woods can be quite challenging.

For me, I started surf fishing for Striped bass. Prime Surf casting season was also deer season. In NY at the time, it was 1 deer per season. So when you finally got your first deer you couldn't hunt again for a year! So I never went hunting.

The a$$hole factor. In the fall of 1992 I was standing on a rock in 6 feet of water near the Montauk lighthouse around 11 PM. Had my wetsuit on and was happily catching schoolie bass in the 6 to 10 lb range every 15 to 20 casts. I hear what I thought was a baitfish breaking water. A few minutes later another plop. This continued until one of the "baitfish" bumped my leg. I finally turned on my light to see what the fish were feeding on and saw a 7", 3oz Stan Gibbs "bottle plug" swimming 6" from my calf! I was 50yards from the beach and this yutz saw me catching fish and decided they were around me!
When I asked him why he was casting AT ME he said "I wanna catch fish too"!
A week later I was invited to go deer hunting with some friends on public land. I thought about that "bass-hole" and envisioned the rod being replaced with a gun. I told my hunting friends I had fish to catch.

Now I know some good hunters who have access to private land so I might give it a try, but it's not at the top of my agenda. I'm 54 now and I want to teach my 12 year old how to build his own rods and plugs. I haven't hunted in 54 years. I can wait a little longer.

[Dave Holquist]

I don't think it's the hunter safety course at all. Possibly the biggest reason for the dwindling number of kids entering this sport is the negative image in which hunting is portrayed by teachers in our schools.

Even if a kid doesn't buy into the anti-hunting message and desires to learn to hunt, it's dependent upon that kid's parents to offer the support and mentoring or find a friend who is able and willing to do the mentoring part. Most parents who don't hunt won't provide the support, let alone the mentoring. Maybe not so much that they are against hunting but they themselves don't understand the desire to hunt. Besides, many of these non-hunting parents would rather their kid strive to be the next Arnold Palmer, Michael Jordan, Babe Ruth, etc.

On top of that, there are so many other activities offered to kids, especially in more urban areas, that they are easily disuaded from choosing hunting because these other activities are already highly organized and all they have to do is sign up and go.

[tuffshot]

On top of that, there are so many other activities offered to kids, especially in more urban areas, that they are easily disuaded from choosing hunting because these other activities are already highly organized and all they have to do is sign up and go.

Yea, like drugs, glue sniffin, car jacking and date rape to name a few. Video games among others such as sports programs that they hold over the tax payers heads to pass levys.

Sorry, couldn't resist:)

[ahshoot]

When I took mine, 2 kids flunked the final test. They came out of the back room crying. The instructor let them take it again by themselves, and they passed and come out happy. So what was the point of the test?

One question, what about kids without a strong male role model to teach them how to hunt safely? It seems without at least some training that part of the future generation may fall through the cracks.

[Esquire]

When my oldest was about 8 I overheard a conversation between Grafton (my son) and the neighbor kid in which my son had just described home-schooling...

Kid "Well, one good thing about school is - you get to get away from your mom and dad."

Grafton "Why would you want to get away from your mom and dad? My dad takes me hunting and fishing!"

Kid "You like to hunt and fish???"

Grafton "ye-ah!"

Kid "not me, man. I lie to play video games"

Long silence. Oh, I was listening hard from the other room!!!

Grafton "Well...everyone has their own life to lead. Your life can be video games. MY life is going to be hunting and fishing with my dad!!!"

Did I just die and go to heaven?

Take a kid hunting!!!

Here is Grafton's first buck, a year later...